NJ Gov. Murphy: It's a pandemic of the unvaccinated

New Jersey Governor Phil Murphy (D) joins Yahoo Finance Live to discuss the latest with COVID-19 as the delta variant spreads.

Video transcript

- New Jersey has seen its new number of infections jump by more than 150% over the last two weeks. While hospitalizations have jumped roughly 20%.

Let's bring in our first guest for the hour. We've got New Jersey Governor Phil Murphy joining us today, along with our very own Anjolie Khemlani. And Governor, it's always great to have you on the show.

New Jersey, of course, we're highlighting today. But certainly no exception in seeing the uptick in cases, especially among those who are not vaccinated. How are you processing these numbers right now? And at what point do you say we're going to bring back those restrictions that we had in place at the height of the pandemic?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Good. Good. To be back on with you. Thank you for having me. Nothing to report by the way on our quarterly earnings. In terms of the pandemic, you're absolutely right in terms of the uptick.

But I would say two things. Other than it's concerning for sure. Number 1, it is an uptick from a very low level. So we're now 400 and something people in the hospital.

Our peak of April of last year was 82,070. We were 10 times where we are today in January of this year.

So we're very concerned. We're watching it. But the good news is we started at a low level. And secondly, it is a pandemic of the unvaccinated.

We think in the hospital it is 99-- literally 99.99% likely that the folks are in the hospital are unvaccinated. So we are still out there going door to door using our bully pulpit, using contest, whatever we can use to get to people, to get them to get vaccinated.

We're making-- you know, we're among the most vaccinated states in America. We are the most vaccinated big state in America. But we're still not yet where we need to be, and we'll stay out of it.

- Speaking about that Governor again. Good to speak with you. Tell me about the discussions that are happening maybe about vaccine mandates. We know that California and New York have implemented them. Have you had discussions about doing that as well?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Good to see actually. So everything is on the table. I would just put it that way. We have to have everything on the table.

The virus dictates the terms here. Not me or anybody else. And we watch the science of the data like a hawk.

We'll continue to. I noted as you suggest both New York and in California taking steps. We're hearing the same things that you are in terms of the potential action by the CDC. You got to leave everything on the table we have come such, such a far away.

And overwhelmingly, folks have done the right thing. And because they've done the right thing, they are overwhelmingly protected against this virus.

So we've opened the state up. We want to make sure we get this balance right. And we'll continue to try to do that every day.

- And Governor as you mentioned, I mean, we have come a long ways. But now, I mean, with the Delta variant, and the stats coming out of it. Obviously concerning everything about close to 30% efficacy. And that Israeli study when it comes to the Pfizer vaccine.

In transmission, you're right to point out hospitalization is still down and working on that front. But I mean, just as you kind of assess. And if we do return to federal mandates coming through here, I mean, what's kind of the appetite in there in New Jersey when it comes to maybe reinstituting some of these things if indeed cases continue to rise?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Yeah. I mean, the two things that number 1, just because you're fully vaccinated does not mean you can't get COVID because you're seeing breakthrough cases. We're seeing them here in New Jersey. You're seeing them all around the world.

But-- and this is the important point, it is overwhelmingly the vaccines are overwhelmingly effective against hospitalization or worse. And that's the important point to-- to underscore.

What's the appetite? Not much as you can imagine. People have-- have had it with this pandemic. I mean, they've come through. We've paid an enormous price in New Jersey.

Well, over now bearing down on 27,000 losses of life. Month after month of folks doing the right thing whether you're a small business, or restaurant, or an individual. You know, while there are always knuckleheads out there or people who are just behaving in a way that is not consistent with the facts overwhelmingly in our state. The people have done the right thing.

But they're-- they're tired of this. And who could blame them? The mental health toll has been significant. The toll on our economy has been significant. So we'll do what we need to do.

But in terms of appetite from the man on the street, it's low. And who could blame them? Particularly if they're-- if they're fully vaccinated, and they've done the right thing.

- Governor, I want to follow up on that question. Anjolie just asked about a potential new vaccine mandate. You mentioned everything is on the table clearly from a state perspective. You've got to be watching a number of variables.

But I wonder what specifically you're waiting for? What will it take for you to say, look, this is it. We've got to get the mandates in place at least from state employees to-- to set an example or at least get the ball rolling? What are the barriers that we've watching?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Yeah. Not-- not all settings are created equally as you can imagine. So we oversee a hospital, University Hospital in Newark. That's a different reality. Or psychiatric hospitals that we operate, or prisons that we operate.

So if it's a health care setting, if it's a vulnerable community, that's-- that's something, where we're-- we're already at a very aggressive posture. It won't be one-- it won't be one data point. And it has been since the get go.

The-- the-- the biggest X factor is continuing to get the percentage of our population vaccinated. So that's our huge focus right now and it has been for months.

We look at a collection of health metrics, and we'll continue to do that. The one thing we cannot allow, which we came in close to in April of 2020, we cannot allow our health care systems, our hospitals to get overrun.

Thankfully as we sit here now, we're far from that. Thank God. And God willing, we'll, stay that way.

So-- so it's not one answer. It's not one moment in time. But we watch all of this. And if we have to pull a lever, we will pull it.

- Governor, I know that a lot of focus has been put on health equity as well. And the idea that you need to really put in more outreach efforts to make sure that those who don't readily have access to the vaccines do so. At what point do you think that those efforts maybe need to stop, and that, you know, everyone who wants a vaccine, or is willing to get it will have gotten it, and you need to sort of wrap that up and move on?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Yeah. I mean, we've got pretty specific as you can imagine data that-- that guides us in terms of our penetration into communities, particularly Black and Brown communities, where there are rightful reasons for folks not to be vaccinated.

The folks who would not vaccinated yet who are eligible. There's a block of folks who are believing myths. They're listening to talking heads or social media. And that's really frustrating.

But there's also a block of people who are not vaccinated for-- for very valid reasons. They may not speak English. They're concerned that their immigration status will be held against them.

They think that it costs a lot of money. They may work two or three jobs. They may not know where the nearest location is.

We've got almost 1,500 locations as I said here in New Jersey today. But they may not know that. So you know, is-- are there diminishing returns? Yes, there are as you go forward through time.

But we're still not where we need to be as it relates to equity or the overall program. So we're going to stay out of it. I think we're knocking on doors today in 33 communities in the state.

And I'd venture to say about 26 of them are majority communities of our majority Black or Brown community communities in the state. And we'll stay out of it.

- Governor, if we can switch to what you're seeing from a macro level as we try to get a better pulse of where the economic recovery stands right now. We've spoken to a lot of businesses who have raised concerns about rising costs particularly around labor and the tight labor market right now having to raise wages, add incentives.

What are you seeing in your state? Where do things stand from a top down view?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Yeah. A similar reality the economy is booming, which is a great thing. Although this variant of the pandemic generally is a risk to that recovery.

We needed this recovery desperately. We had 30% of our small businesses closed. Thankfully a bunch of them are reopening.

We had two million unemployment benefit claims. So we need this recovery. But the recovery in New Jersey, I think this is true in America is well out ahead of the labor market.

And there I think a number of reasons for that. And you're absolutely right. When I speak to restaurant owners, or bar owners, or small businesses, they're trying a lot of different things, they're including paying up for labor.

I think there is for all of the factors that go into this sort of lagging labor market. I do subscribe to the-- the economists who have the view that there's also a positive element to this in the sense that when you have an economy that's recovering at such a breakneck pace as ours is.

You get folks who leave a job or don't go back to a job with a positive spin as opposed to a negative one when the economy is going down. In other words, they have confidence that they can upsell themselves, upskill themselves to a more fulfilling, higher paying, more value added job. But I think you're seeing a significant amount of that going on as well.

- And Governor Murphy, to wrap up here another key sector coming online there in New Jersey. Something you pushed for when it comes to the legalization-- legalization of marijuana. About a month away from your guys' Regulatory Commission, moving forward with the laws around how it's going to be built out, you got municipalities. They're now kind of choosing whether or not they want to allow it or not in their town specifically.

When you look at that and kind of the timeline you're operating here to get to that next step, what is the timeline you're expecting to see for recreational sales to come on? And I guess, you know, how is that process going in your mind as you try and get it off the ground?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Yeah, good question, Zack. It's going well. The commission which is promulgating the rules and they've got till the end of August to get those out there. They're working morning, noon, and night to get there.

As a reminder, I got to supporting this because of social justice. And so equity runs through all of their deliberations that's that runs through all of my passion for why we're doing this.

Will it create jobs, new businesses, revenue for the state? Absolutely. I'll take all of that. We need it. But most importantly, it is allowing us to address enormous social injustices, racial injustices that have existed for far too long.

I think, Zack, to two quick footnotes. Medical marijuana dispensaries of which we have many. I suspect assuming that they can prove that they've got a stable supply for their clients. They'll get to be selling recreational before.

That's probably a matter of months before the standalone recreational retail establishments are up and running. And they will come online at some point after that. And obviously, folks are working morning, noon, and night as I said, to get to this point sooner than later.

We want to most importantly, get this right. That's more important than the speed. But both are objectives clearly.

- Yeah. And we were chatting with Senator Cory Booker also from New Jersey just last week kind of around, you know, exactly what you're talking about. Having both things aligned. The companies are growing.

Of course, creating jobs in the sector. But also the social justice initiatives there as well. New Jersey doing both of those here.

But I suppose there is that question as we await federal changes here. Kind of the idea that they are opposed that you can't have both at the same time. What would you say to that, though, as you kind of see a bunch of companies there in New Jersey growing quickly as they prepare for recreational sales? How they aren't necessarily opposed? And how you want to see both sides win social justice and the growth you're expecting in New Jersey?

GOV. PHIL MURPHY: Yeah. Yeah. So-- so again, good question. So I know our clock is short. So I'll be brief. We have also a lot of loopback stuff that we've done.

Expungement is a big one. We've got I think the nation's most progressive and aggressive program for righting the wrongs associated with the war on drugs that have ruined too many lives, particularly young men of color.

But-- but there's no reason as the industry gets stood up that we cannot have it both ways. That we cannot-- that we cannot achieve equity and who gets the licenses where the-- the retail establishments are located, et cetera. And at the same time, have a God willing a booming new sector to our economy.

I'm extremely optimistic. We'll be able to have both. We must have the former. And I believe we will have the latter as well.

- All right. Governor Murphy from New Jersey. Appreciate you coming on here to chat with us again. Be well. And our thanks to Yahoo Finance's essentially. Good morning again.